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Post by heavyg on Jun 19, 2009 12:56:29 GMT -7
i am one of the people that couldn't even get a home when they were giving them to people who shouldn't have them! Did you try? Cause I had just come off 2 yrs of being out of work (hurt on duty) and a Bank Ruptcy. Im pretty sure if you looked hard enough you would have been able to.
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Post by ArkCowboy on Jun 19, 2009 17:03:26 GMT -7
not owing IRS and school loans
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Post by yumacactus on Jun 19, 2009 19:21:43 GMT -7
Are you that dude Tim Gietner? Too much, talking about the rich paying taxes and you owe the IRS.......That is the definition of irony......rofl
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Post by ArkCowboy on Jun 19, 2009 20:24:25 GMT -7
that is what happens when you are a poor boy, you might not understand it's not a question of can pay it but don't, it is a question of who gets paid and who doesn't when the bills are due you'll pardon me for desiring a home with utilities, a vehicle and food?
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Post by yumacactus on Jun 21, 2009 9:50:21 GMT -7
Well isn't that what liberalism/socialism/progressivism is all about. Someone doesn't have, so take it from someone else and give it to them i.e. redistribution of wealth. If ever there was a country where you can go as far as your desire/effort can take you it is these United States. Maybe if you put down the bong you would be more motivated to excel. I have no college education, was kicked out of the military(drugs), but I figured out that I needed to put that stuff away and work hard. The point is that people hold themselves back and want to drag others down to thier level instead of ascending to thier own dreams.
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Post by ArkCowboy on Jun 21, 2009 19:42:38 GMT -7
oh stop with the self righteous sanctimonious BS!! as if it were any of your business, i make plenty NOW! but i did not for a long time. i had to withdraw from college in year 5 for personal issues, with huge student loan debt, and fell behind badly on the credit card trying to deal a deficit in income for several years and only in the last couple of years have i begun to get my head above water. i fell behind with the IRS. being self employed i spent my tax money on bills rather than sending it in, but i am paying that back now. i work hard, i make enough and i am a respected responsible citizen who owns his own business, i do contracting work on the side, i give to multiple charities regularly and i have been a mentor for 8 years. what do you give of yourself? a little less self importance might serve you well!! though i couldn't give a $#!T what you think, heavyg will no doubt vouch for the caliber of person i am since he knows me personally for a long time now. and yes, to use your expression, i believe in the redistribution of wealth. most of the people that have money would not give back society given the option. government run, tax paid social programs rectify that. rich people should give more IMO!!
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Post by heavyg on Jun 22, 2009 6:56:05 GMT -7
oh stop with the self righteous sanctimonious BS!! as if it were any of your business, i make plenty NOW! but i did not for a long time. i had to withdraw from college in year 5 for personal issues, with huge student loan debt, and fell behind badly on the credit card trying to deal a deficit in income for several years and only in the last couple of years have i begun to get my head above water. i fell behind with the IRS. being self employed i spent my tax money on bills rather than sending it in, but i am paying that back now. i work hard, i make enough and i am a respected responsible citizen who owns his own business, i do contracting work on the side, i give to multiple charities regularly and i have been a mentor for 8 years. what do you give of yourself? a little less self importance might serve you well!! though i couldn't give a $#!T what you think, heavyg will no doubt vouch for the caliber of person i am since he knows me personally for a long time now. and yes, to use your expression, i believe in the redistribution of wealth. most of the people that have money would not give back society given the option. government run, tax paid social programs rectify that. rich people should give more IMO!! While Kevin and I probably dissagree on just about everything with the exception of the Dallas Cowboys. I have to say he has one of the biggests hearts around. He works very hard at his job. Just don't get on his bad side on the political side of things....lol If we could just get him to see the light ;D
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Post by yumacactus on Jun 22, 2009 21:37:09 GMT -7
Please Ark check the stats on who gives more. Republicans or Dems, and specifically the percentage of income given by these last 2 presidential candidates. Self importance? Where did you get that? If you earn the money you should have the right to do with it what you will.
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Post by yumacactus on Jun 26, 2009 23:42:29 GMT -7
Have you checked the stats to see who is more charitable Ark? So it seems as though you spoke without knowing the truth, just assuming that "rich evil republicans" aren't charitable. Lib's are very giving......with other peoples money!
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Post by ArkCowboy on Jun 27, 2009 5:01:03 GMT -7
the simple fact of the matter is that the wealthier you are the more you have to give, they simply have more to give after the cost of living. i wrote this in relation to tax's but it applies to charity as well:
... when (tax) revenue dries up public safety, education, the social safety net all suffer and society as whole suffers!! obviously it takes money to survive and for regular people it takes all that they make (or more) to do that. for the wealthy that is not a concern. for those people who made their wealth in this land of opportunity, and have plenty to get by on, it is only fair IMO to expect that they pay a bigger share than the people who are not wealthy.
i will take it a step further in regards to charitable giving. conservatives are far more likely to be religious and not surprisingly their giving will be to religious charities. inevitably these charities indulge in proselytizing, so in essence this "giving" is an effort to finance the efforts at conversion! how many shelters will feed you and give you a bed, and oh by the way here is a free bible for you also! the bed and food does not come without strings attached, there are overt attempts at conversion! is giving with an agenda selfless? NO! another undeniable point is that a further reason for charitable giving among the rich is not simply the giving, it is for the tax break!! again, agenda based giving.
who is giving more, the regular guy who gives $20 from his hand to mouth budget or the rich guy who gives $1000 from his surplus of income?
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Post by heavyg on Jun 27, 2009 7:45:26 GMT -7
the simple fact of the matter is that the wealthier you are the more you have to give, they simply have more to give after the cost of living. i wrote this in relation to tax's but it applies to charity as well: ... when (tax) revenue dries up public safety, education, the social safety net all suffer and society as whole suffers!! obviously it takes money to survive and for regular people it takes all that they make (or more) to do that. for the wealthy that is not a concern. for those people who made their wealth in this land of opportunity, and have plenty to get by on, it is only fair IMO to expect that they pay a bigger share than the people who are not wealthy.i will take it a step further in regards to charitable giving. conservatives are far more likely to be religious and not surprisingly their giving will be to religious charities. inevitably these charities indulge in proselytizing, so in essence this "giving" is an effort to finance the efforts at conversion! how many shelters will feed you and give you a bed, and oh by the way here is a free bible for you also! the bed and food does not come without strings attached, there are overt attempts at conversion! is giving with an agenda selfless? NO! another undeniable point is that a further reason for charitable giving among the rich is not simply the giving, it is for the tax break!! again, agenda based giving. who is giving more, the regular guy who gives $20 from his hand to mouth budget or the rich guy who gives $1000 from his surplus of income? Again what is wrong with a non profit religious org who feeds, cloths and shelters these people giving them a bible. If they don't want the bible they can toss it when they walk out the door. They are not being forced to read it or convert. They simply being told hey you have tried it your way now why not give God a chance. Then its up to them to do it or not. If they don't want the Bible or listen to the Word then they should go to a state ran shelter......Wait are there any?
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Post by ArkCowboy on Jun 27, 2009 9:17:35 GMT -7
my point was not intended to vilify the proselytizing per se, i was questioning those that give with an agenda. i suppose it is better than not giving it at all, but i refuse to let it be thrown out there like it makes them 'more giving' when there is no sacrifice whatsoever but is instead a means to an end. technically it may be statistically correct but it is not an accurate measure of who is actually giving the highest percentage of nonessential income
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Post by heavyg on Jun 27, 2009 11:41:07 GMT -7
my point was not intended to vilify the proselytizing per se, i was questioning those that give with an agenda. i suppose it is better than not giving it at all, but i refuse to let it be thrown out there like it makes them 'more giving' when there is no sacrifice whatsoever but is instead a means to an end. technically it may be statistically correct but it is not an accurate measure of who is actually giving the highest percentage of nonessential income There are plenty of rich people on both sides that give. but lets be honest. Most are not giving out of the kindness of their heart. They are doing it for the tax break. That is why the rich really do not pay alot of taxes. they have the "extra" money to find the loop holes in the system to avoid the taxes.
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Post by scorpion42 on Jun 27, 2009 13:59:01 GMT -7
There's an organization called Catholic Charities. Its not just locally, its a national organization. I never knew, until I put it in a search engine.
They have eight outlets in my state alone. Its in the big cities, though.
I know someone who just get a new furnace put in their house. I also know someone else, who didn't even contact them. When they were having problems with their furnace.
I don't understand why, people are afraid to ask for help? When they really need it. Rather if its from a church, or some other organization? I guess its called, pride.
If someone gave me a Washington Redskins t-shirt? I'd except the gift. Knowing me, I'd give it to my nephew for a Christmas present. Since he's a Deadskins fan.
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Post by yumacactus on Jun 27, 2009 15:59:20 GMT -7
Still dancing around the question Ark. You slammed republicans and then said they didin't give to charity. I asked you a specific question relating to % of income. So it has nothing to do with rich or poor. Please check what the Messiah, Barrack Obama gave as a percentage of income on his last 5 IRS returns. Are you afraid or would you rather just keep dancing? So in your world people should only give to what you(liberals) deem worthy? Typical.......
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